Bad Gearbox????

[twa]

subie trannys are extremely difficult to do, I assume CHip won't touchit.. but maybe worth a phone call..

I stopped over to see him, and he doesn't do too many tranny's. He has seen a lot of problematic WRX tranny's though.... He did recommend someone in Windham that rebuilds transmissions, and specializes in "race" cars. He sounded like an honest guy, and recommended to keep on SOA....

my expirience with them is they charged me 50% more than what i told them i could spend, didnt fix the problem, then my keys 'went missing' from their rack and $300 worth of gauges and stuff went missing from my car the next day.

that was the first and last time i will ever pay someone to work on my car.

That is the suck, I'm sorry to hear about that. I would definitely be WICKED pissed!

 

[rallyXcramps]

The price from Rallispec seems very reasonable. I just did a Saturn trans rebuild and they charged the customer way more than that.

If you do a swap, and the old trans does not need to be a core, don't let them have it. Keep it and we'll teach ourselves how to rebuild a scooby trans.

 

[twa]

Last week SOA approved the process to review if the tranny would be covered under warranty or not. Basically what that means is that at my risk and after I authorized the tear down Patriot will remove the tranny and tear down for damage review.

Which means if the damage is covered under warranty than I won't be responsible for the tear down costs, but if they think it should not be covered I get bent over for the tear down + the costs incurred for getting a working tranny into the car.

Patriot said they should have the tranny off and torn down today (monday 1/23).

I did find out that the tranny still has the original matching serial number which means that the transmission has been rebuilt twice by Exeter Subaru and has not been completely replaced yet.

I'm getting the runaround trying to get the prior service history on the car. Exeter Subaru will not release the information without the permission of the prior owner. When asked if this is a shop policy or SOA policy they stated, "shop policy". I've asked for the same information from Patriot and I'm waiting for a response.

I will report back with more info as I have it....

 

[Lawdawg]

If patriot cannot get repair history, write a letter addressed both to Exeter subaru and SOA, breifly explaining your situation, and "re-new" your request for a repair history regardless of "shop policy." You own the car--that shop policy sounds BS to me, especially in light of your current situation where you bear the risk on a tranny you cannot get a history on.... Also seems to me you really need to know what Exeter did to make your case with SOA.... For sure SOA has requested and or has access to what was done previously to your tranny

 

[twa]

SOA's district field rep has now officially denied the claim because the teeth on second gear are "sheared" off. Aparantly the teeth are sheared on the 2nd drive gear and driven gear which are phyically apart of the main shaft. From what I understand Patriot has no pull in the situation and I'm waiting to talk to the Team Lead for SOA that has denied the claim for further information.

Patriot has quoted me $2100 for a tranny rebuild, and $4100 a new tranny. On the side I've asked their service manager about the prospect of installing the RA rallispec gears (if i supply parts) to see how much they would charge for labor since the car is already there.

It feels like I have fire coming out of my ears right now. Patriot was able to have SOA approve the release of prior service history, provided they remove the previous owner's contact information.

I don't know what to do next. I don't know if it's worth my time to call a lawyer. Provided that the SOA does not reverse their decision I believe I have two options for the car:

1) Pay $1600 + installation costs for RA rallispec gears and have awesome tranny and keep the car I have loved for the last six months. With this option I'm taking a risk that the warranty may or may not cover any future failures on other parts ex: motor.

2) Sell my BPM exhaust, Sell Cobb accessport. Buy used replacement tranny. Sell or Trade in car.

Probably would take a little loss on the car. After knowing the previous owner trashed the stock tranny twice with a bone stock car that wasn't modified I wouldn't trust another replacement tranny for daily commuting or performance driving. With the low mileage on the car it should sell pretty easily, and it's still worth quite a bit on trade provided it's rolling at the time. I'll be able to change over to a different manuf. that I won't run into warranty problems like this.

My girlfiend has an Audi, they have been awesome so far (had a steering rack replaced on 2002 a4). Mazda warranty service has been great to me in the past. My friends have had great luck with BMW warranties.

the letter of the day = S

Subaru SUCKS

 

[Runnah]

Don't make any rash decision right now while your angry. Cool off for a bit and then go into this rationally.

Next send SOA a dead fish.

 

[twa]

I don't find those as rash decisions, but as my only options?

What would y'all do?

 

[Runnah]

I don't find those as rash decisions, but as my only options?

What would y'all do?

I was refering to selling the car. I'm sure Vinnie can hook you up if you go that route.

Can you appeal SOA's ruling? Maybe to the Better Business Bearu?

Seems to me like a twice rebuilt tranny that has crapped out again with such low miles is deffinetly a warrenty item.

 

[Lawdawg]

I presume you have the decision to deny the claim in writing. I would respond and ask if they have appeal or review procedures for warranty denials, and if they do, take advantage of them. If there is anything you do not understand in the denial, ask them to explain. For instance, what is the basis for denying the claim for "sheared" gears. Ask for specific citation to the warranty. Oh yeah, read your warranty cover to cover-especially drivetrain stuff.

All of the above letters are in writing and copies to SOA customer service and maybe even the Maine Better Business Bureau--keep your own copy as well. I would not hire an attorney as it will cost you too much for the amount at issue.

You might even call shops like vermont sports car or Patrick Richard's shop in CA. They may sell the trannys they pull out of cars before they make into rally cars.

You could file a claim in small claims court for the repair amount, but I suspect the warranty has an arbitration clause.

Good luck and remember sometimes the squeaky wheel...... you may have to be real squeaky though--but professional not angry squeaky.

 

[twa]

I've spoken with the Team lead of the District Field rep for SOA which went absolutely no-where. I get different answers from every individual that I talk to, but the same result in the end of SOA not approving the warranty work. The field rep commented that it was a combined decision between them and Patriot, where the service manager (Mark Stevens) mentioned that it's TOTALLY up to SOA.

I'm really unsure who made the final call on the decision, but I do know that the answer probably won't change. They've said that second gear teeth were probably sheared off during high rpm shifting. Where I've read that second gear usually breaks teeth when there is play in the main shaft, which makes sense since second is attached to the shaft.

I think I'm far too dissappointed by this event to continue owning a Subaru. I need a car / car manufacturer that I can trust. The crap I just went through with this one is just complete B/S. I've read too much negative feedback of people's dealings with Subaru warranty work.

 

[Lawdawg]

Sorry to hear it. One reason to get these things in writing and/or confirm conversations in writing is so that they can't change the answer depending on who you speak with. I know it's a pain, but you will not be taken seriously until you place pen to paper.

 

[Runnah]

Sorry to hear it.

 

[Rightseat]

SOA's bunker mentality against tuner people is sad and short-sighted. They have turned off a lot of enthusiasts that way, ppl who eventually might buy a Legacy wagon or Tribeca or watever for the family.

On the other hand, I can understand how at the corporate level, they have to be really careful about honoring warranty repairs for tuned vehicles. Yours sounds like it's tuned enough to set off red flags for them. I can understand this attitude, but that doesn't mean I like it! Your experience is a hard reminder that performance-minded enthusiasts are really-truly-100% ON OUR OWN own when we decide to mod a car

But the 3-time loser gearbox...sheesh. The blame game could go round and round -- was it Subaru who did a bad gearbox build initially, or Exeter's rebuilds? Karma? or what.

You mention your freind's experience with Audi warranty...realize tht Audi frequency of repair is so bad that they HAVE to keep customers happy somehow. My bro-in-law has a black Audi wagon that they have nicknamed SAtan because of its total unreliability.

DG

PS--Audi dlrs are quick to deny warranty work on tuned cars, too.

 

[twa]

It wasn't denied because of modifications. It was denied because they sent digital photographs to SOA and they saw sheared teeth off second drive and driven gear and denied the claim because of that. They didn't not mention they saw my BPM exhaust, or the date my ECU was reflashed. They clearly said because the nature of the gears being sheared off in that manner leads them to believe it was caused by high rpm shifting.

We've had nothing but great times with my family's Audi 100 (now with 179k). On top of that I've always had great luck with VW's and high mileage. Audi and VW share lots of parts, especially lately. My girlfriend's 2002 Audi A4 has been great. 1.8t with 30k when she got it, now has 70k. It has been in the shop one time.

My WRX on the other hand went through two transmissions while bone stock in the first 16k miles. Now needs a third rebuild 12k miles later. = Satan2

 

[Lawdawg]

Funny you should mention Audi's and 1.8t's with about 70K. I helped a friend battle with Audi over a warranty issue to no avail. If you do not already know, certain year 1.8t's are prone to oil sludge buildup, which can cause oil pump failureeven with proper maintenance and oil change. His car began to show loud valve noise pre-50K, that he brought to dealer's attention and this was documented. They said no problem.

He was heading back from Mass on the highway, at highway speed, post-50K on the clock, and the thing just puked its guts in the road--no alarms--nothing. Rod through the case due to oil starvation. The pan had plenty of oil in it. The failure was more likely than not due to an acknowledged problem, but Audi said pound sand because you are 5K out of warranty.

See link below as an example--this was not my friend, I just googled and found all kinds of stuff

http://www.thesqueakywheel.com/complaints/2005/FEB/complaint6043.cfm

Point being, they all suck if they can get away with it.

 

[twa]

Yah, but Audi, VW and other vendors have taken steps to extend their warranty because it's a known issue. I knew about the problem before buying the a4. The problem mainly exists with consumer who frequently do short trips and don't change their oil. My GF does mostly highway driving like myself, no problems (knocking on wood).

Here's an article about the problem:

http://www.autospies.com/article/index.asp?articleId=3281

Here's a PDF of a letter Audi sent:

http://www.autospies.com/images/uploads/files/AudiOilSludge.pdf

Here are also a list of other cars that have suffered from the same issue:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oil_sludge

So my point is, car's have issues...but at least VW, Audi and SAAB have all aknowledged this problem in the public. Subaru won't at admit they have a shitty gearbox, but we all know that's the case after reading endless clubwrx and nasioc posts....

 

[Rightseat]

Yah, but Audi, VW and other vendors have taken steps to extend their warranty because it's a known issue.

 

[twa]

Correction. Three sheety tranny's. I'm well aware of my new selections not be able to perform as well. I'm am HUGE car nut and don't need to debate the certain merits of vehicles. How do you think I came to owning a wrx in the first place? Although Mitsu was pretty impressive with 5 WRC's in a row, I was equally impressed with Subaru's racing heritage. I'm unhappy with my "Subaru" experience and simply wish to swtich to a respectable manufacturer. I enjoyed my DSM ownership much more.

 

[Rightseat]

Correction. Three sheety tranny's.

correction to the correction (and in all fairness to your situation): one sheety tranny followed by 2 crappy half-baked and evidently useless rebuilds. I simply cannot believe that SOA does not recognize the fact that your car's gearbox is a mess and needs to be replaced, period. they have come down on the side of protecting their dealers as opposed satisfying to their customers...and that's dumb.

anyway...(ready to kick a beehive now)

U R a DSM fan? heesh, talk about warranty problems, reliability problems, problem problems...we have passed more busted Evos on the side of stage roads than you would believe. In the street-car world, crushing warranty costs have driven Mitsu's US division to the brink of bankruptcy. Mitsu US did warranty work in a vain effort to hold US customers that should never have been contemplated from a sustainable business point of view. If this is your point of reference for "what should be covered under warranty" no wonder you've had a rude awakening.

there is a very good reason that Mitsu is sucking total wind in the US market and worldwide for that matter. (besides the fact they have incredibly yuck-o cars except for the Evo) -- they have worse freqeuncy of repair and resale numbers than even Chrysler or Hyundai. only Land Rover is worse. this is not DSM-bashing, it;'s truth.

 

[rallyXcramps]

I have a VW.